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Author Topic: Best 45LC cylinder?  (Read 428 times)

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Offline 07Kingpin

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Best 45LC cylinder?
« on: June 15, 2020, 03:00:47 PM »
Just picked up an EMF Pietta Target model 1858.

Plan to shoot it as is with BP/round ball and with a conversin cylinder to 45 Long Colt.

What is the best conversion cylinder for this pistol?

Offline AntiqueSledMan

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #1 on: June 15, 2020, 04:47:15 PM »
Hello 07Kingpin,

There is no such thing as a "best conversion cylinder".
Everything available today is good quality.
You have to decide what you want, loading gate, or not? 5 shot or 6?
Kirst makes excellent cylinders as does Howell,
The choice is all yours.

AntiqueSledMan.

Offline 07Kingpin

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #2 on: June 15, 2020, 04:49:21 PM »
Good points, thanks.

5 or 6 rounds is not relevent to me, accuracy and reliability are 


Offline Hawg

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #3 on: June 15, 2020, 05:07:25 PM »
Keep in mind there may be timing issues with a conversion. If you have to time the conversion the C&B cylinder wont be in time. I don't know what the odds are on it but it does happen.
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Offline ssb73q

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2020, 05:29:32 AM »
Keep in mind there may be timing issues with a conversion. If you have to time the conversion the C&B cylinder wont be in time. I don't know what the odds are on it but it does happen.

Hi Hawg, I have never experienced a timing issue going from C&B to Conversion Cylinder with any of my many 1858s and Taylor (Howell) conversion cylinders. Since the conversion cylinders are larger diameter than the C&B, the bolt drops early before going into the conversion cylinder bolt slot. The conversion cylinders have an ordnance steel were there isn't any damage to the cylinder with the bolt dropping early. The only potential timing issue is with Pietta and conversion cylinders is that the bolt leg may need to be thinned so it hops over the hammer cam easily. If the conversion cylinder rotates backwards on lowering the hammer, Pietta has that timing issue. If one buys their conversion cylinder from Taylor Firearms they will either supply a proper bolt, or install the conversion cylinder for free on a customer's revolver if the customer has the Pietta bolt issue.

Since the Pietta's and Uberti 1858s are soft steel, I don't recommend the Kirst cylinders that have a 1000fps rating. IMO that's too hot for these weak framed revolvers. IMO the 850fps rated conversion cylinders are optimal. I will always select a 6-shot 1858 conversion cylinder compared to the 5-shot conversion cylinder.

Regards,
Richard
« Last Edit: June 16, 2020, 05:33:37 AM by ssb73q »

Offline Hawg

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2020, 09:06:11 AM »
Keep in mind there may be timing issues with a conversion. If you have to time the conversion the C&B cylinder wont be in time. I don't know what the odds are on it but it does happen.

Hi Hawg, I have never experienced a timing issue going from C&B to Conversion Cylinder with any of my many 1858s and Taylor (Howell) conversion cylinders.

I'm not saying it's a common thing but I've been around enough forums to know it does happen.
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and tasteth good with ketchup.

Offline 07Kingpin

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2020, 05:25:24 PM »
Great information thanks.

If the timing is off how is that resolved?

I have no need or desire to run hot loads in this, an 850fps max is well within reason.  I will be casting and hand loading so no worries there.  Purely out of curiosity as it was brought up- some conversion cylinders are rated at higher fps loads than others?  Would the frame of the revolver "stretch" if loaded too hot?  Again- no intent whatsoever to do this but now my curiosity is piqued. 

Offline Hawg

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2020, 08:29:01 PM »
Great information thanks.

If the timing is off how is that resolved?

Usually just hand length. Replacing it if it's too short, shortening it if it's too long.

I have no need or desire to run hot loads in this, an 850fps max is well within reason.  I will be casting and hand loading so no worries there.  Purely out of curiosity as it was brought up- some conversion cylinders are rated at higher fps loads than others?  Would the frame of the revolver "stretch" if loaded too hot?  Again- no intent whatsoever to do this but now my curiosity is piqued.

Most likely it would batter the recoil shield much like a brass frame does.
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and tasteth good with ketchup.

Offline BOOMSTICK BRUCE

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #8 on: June 17, 2020, 12:37:01 AM »
If you're using black or black subs, don't worry about the fps. They list the fps warning because of the pressure smokeless makes to get certain bullets to go certain velocities.

 

I'm told 1000fps with smokeless is like running +p in a gun not designed for +p... It won't go kaboom but it will die an early death.

 

I use 6gn of TB and 200gn rnfp in my kirst 58's (seen in my avatar) that I use as my main match guns for SASS.

 

I have loaded full cases of 45 Colt with triple 7 and the same 200gn bullets and likely got way past the 850 fps mark, probably over 1000fps with the "weaker" r&d drop in cylinders and had no problems...

 
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Offline 07Kingpin

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2020, 03:22:07 PM »
Well I guess I should have gone Taylors.

Ended up with a brand new target model Pietta and a Howell cylinder.  Put the new cylinder in, cocked the hammer and the darn thing rotates backwards when the hammer comes down. 

Haven't fired anything yet so sent an email off to Howells to see what they suggest, will keep y'all posted. 

Offline ssb73q

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2020, 08:51:10 AM »
Hi 07Kingpin, sorry to learn that you have that backwards cylinder rotation. Try buying a new bolt from VTI:

https://www.vtigunparts.com/store/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=67&cat=Pietta+1858+Remington%2C+Tiro

(Item 12)

While you are waiting for the new bolt to arrive, try thinning the bolt leg that goes over the hammer cam and maybe shortening that leg a little. Go slow and test often.

What ever you do, don't use the conversion cylinder until this problem is fixed.

Good Luck.

Regards,
Richard

Offline 07Kingpin

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Re: Best 45LC cylinder?
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2020, 04:11:52 PM »
Heard back from Howell.  They suggested some modifications as well.

I would prefer not to get into the internals, I was looking more for a drop in.

I've heard that Taylor's will fit their cylinder to your frame. 

In no rush whatsoever, seems options are;

A) modify existing frame/cylinder

B) return Howell cylinder and purchase from Taylor, having them make whatever adjustments are necessary. 

I'm definitely leaning toward B but open to suggestions.