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Offline BOOMSTICK BRUCE

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Open carry
« on: March 10, 2015, 12:20:05 AM »
So as some of you know i moved to West Virginia a few months ago. Being a Motherland, i mean Murderland, eh hem, Maryland native, i have always been scared of the police and never ever considered open carry. Even when i lived in Maine, an open carry state, i very rarely open carried due to this life long fear from Md's constrictive laws. Needless to say, i am still extremely uncomfortable carrying open here in WV even though i have seen 4 people doing it since i have been here. So here is my question, do the police screw with open carriers? What are your personal experiences open carrying? Now i dont want this to turn into one of those "well i heard of a friend of my sisters, aunt's, neighbors, best friends, cousin, etc etc got harrassed....", what are YOUR personal experiences?
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Offline G Dog

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #1 on: March 10, 2015, 01:21:22 AM »
1.   "do the police screw with open carriers?"

2.  "What are your personal experiences open carrying?"


In public areas and spaces:

1.   Yes, or would at least like to.  They have contempt for people that 'flash they stil'Nobody likes an exhibitionist. 

2.   The open carriers get laughed at as objects of derision.


Contra wise on both points regarding those who have the good sense, taste and judgment to lawfully conceal. 

Open carry is just another way to 'power strut'.  It reflects deep insecurity and sends just that message.  It's a 'statement' that the OC'er really needs to project power and is perceived by others in just that way.  It's not a very subtle message and not particularly wholesome. Tactically it makes no sense whatever.

My paper for concealed is good in fifty states, since the age of twenty two, and I would be embarrassed to open carry any where it might be permitted.  Open Carry in public places is a bad jacket and really just corny theater.  I know no one in law enforcement that thinks it's anything but nutty.

« Last Edit: March 10, 2015, 02:53:28 AM by G Dog »
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places".  
                                        Ephesians 6:12  (KJV)

Offline Omnivore

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #2 on: March 10, 2015, 01:22:33 AM »
I carry concealed in WA and ID, but occasionally carry openly.  One of our employees had open carried daily for about a year.  We're talking service pistols here now, not the pretty wood and brass and blued steel.  Automatics with spare magazines.  No bad experiences.  Some good ones, even.  We are of course some distance from WV.

If you're new in the state, I'd suggest keep doing what you've been doing, and observing.  Next time you see someone open carrying, talk to them, and if they're open to some discussion, ask them what their experiences have been.

All of my immediate neighbors have seen me open carrying my percussion revolvers, as any time I go out shooting with them I generally have them on a belt on the outside of my coat.  Same goes for hunting season-- I walk out the door with a Hawken type rifle and my gun belt, as open as open carry gets.  No one has ever said a word, and I'm on speaking terms with all my neighbors.  I do that twice a day until I get a deer.

It's different everywhere you go, and of course all it takes is one psycho, frothing at the mouth anti gunner to make a nice day into a potentially tense situation.

A LOT of that decision should hinge on your honest assessment of your personality when confronted unfairly.  How will you react when treated unjustly and unfairly by rude, obnoxious people?  If you know from experience that you can keep your cool, if you know that you'll be a force of reason and calm in the middle of a shitstorm, then by all means open carry all the time.  Otherwise do it very sparingly.  I do it pretty sparingly.

As for the cops' reaction?  Same deal.  Some will be golden and others are as insane and as violent as a crack dealer on steroids who just got robbed by his ex, and will act like you just spit in his face and gave him the finger just because he saw a gun at your hip.  Some cops ARE crack dealers on steroids, for that matter, and the armed citizen is just as scary, and twice as threatening, to that kind of cop as to the regular kind of criminal.  If you face that kind of crazy and stay cool as the Fonze at the malt shop, chillin' with his friends on a lazy Saturday afternoon, then you're good to go.
But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.   James 1:25 (KJV)

So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.   James 2:12. (KJV)

Offline Pustic

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #3 on: March 10, 2015, 07:58:20 AM »
SUZUKIBRUCE, I am also a native of Maryland, and I left there well over 30 years ago vowing never to return to that corrupt state. I lived in Florida for a little over 30 years, and now I live in Kentucky, which is an open carry Gold Star state, and I exercise that right to open carry. The last thing I worry about is Maryland or the police. Here in Kentucky, the police are aware that open carry without a permit is legal, and as long as you are open carrying the proper way, they don't mess with you. Here is a forum that you should check out and join. I am a member of this forum.
http://forum.opencarry.org/

Concealed carry, where you HIDE the exercise of your right to carry arms.
{?( Be ye not afraid of the truth, for the "Truth Has No Agenda".  :9)
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A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

Concealed carry, where you HIDE the exercise of your right to carry arms.

Offline Kaeto

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #4 on: March 10, 2015, 10:59:35 AM »
Bruce as you know I live in Michigan.  During the summer I open carry all the time, and have never had a cop come up to me.

Although the city of Grand Rapids currently has a lawsuit going against them for the treatment one of their cops gave an open carrier.

“The path of the warrior is difficult! We live to protect those who cannot protect themselves! Honour in serving! Honour in defending! Honour in dying for a just cause!”

"A knight is sworn to valor; His heart knows only virtue; His blade defends the helpless; His might upholds the weak; His word speaks only truth,
and his wrath undoes the wicked."

Offline mazo kid

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #5 on: March 10, 2015, 12:53:17 PM »
Wisconsin is an open carry State. I personally do not open carry except on my own property. Two years ago 4 or 5 guys walked into a fast food restaurant in Madison after spending time at a shooting range. They were "open carrying" and the police were called. No confrontation and they were not harassed. However, the guys were doing this to make a point. Yes, they were in their right to do so, but it's not a smart thing to do, in my opinion. In the case that Kaeto posted, it sounds like the police were not even knowledgeable of the law!

Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #6 on: March 10, 2015, 02:22:56 PM »
many states  allow open carry unofficially if not officially.

Too many cops have the wrong attitude these days.
so many of them just look for ways to harass a person, because they can.
Even if it is legal to open carry, I would refrain. Because that one cop might take it upon himself
to define the law his way. Arrest you confiscate the weapon. And then leave it up to you to go through
the courts of hell, to prove your were legally carrying and within your rights.
So I rarely carry anymore.  Yes I have one close by at all times, but just not out in the open.
Around here.
I dislike going into a convenience store here and seeing the clerk armed, with the biggest automatic he can carry.
I don't know his training, his attitude, his mood.  His accuracy. Is he having a bad day, year, life, PTSD, ACID flashback??
Besides unless his life or a customers life is in immediate deadly danger  he can't legally draw and shoot.
Castle doctrine does not apply.  And the so called Make my day / stand your ground is too iffy.
He is only an employee, he does not have the right to use lethal force to protect inanimate objects in the store, such as food. drinks, toiletries, sundry items, or even money.
Besides a determined thief that has preplanned his actions will know before hand the clerk that carries, and will get him off guard with no chance to draw anyway.

So if I were you, I wouldn't carry open or concealed. Maybe have one in the car where the container locks automatically and have the key concealed outside the car. So if stopped and asked what's in the box, tell the cop a gun. He wants you to open it, say you can't you don't have the key on you  (which would be true).
Have the lid blocked open until stopped.
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Offline Omnivore

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #7 on: March 10, 2015, 03:23:18 PM »
Quote
So if I were you, I wouldn't carry open or concealed.

Sorry, DD, but you are confused.  What good is a defense weapon if it's not on your person?  Answer; none at all.

I can accept all manner of concealed verses open carry arguments, as they come down ultimately to personal style and personal discernment of tactics (of both the enemy and the good guys) and probabilities.

I believe these are healthy discussions, but to say, as you did in essence, "Don't carry at all" is to say that you should delegate your responsibility to someone else.  And where does that leave the second amendment?

Also your description of your perception of the armed sales clerk sounds as if it were right out of an anti gun pamphlet promoting fear and distrust of armed citizens. 

Understand however, that the REAL bad guy won’t be carrying openly.  He’ll only let you know he’s armed once he sticks the muzzle in your face and asks for your wallet, or he simply starts shooting, so you’ll never fear him as you fear the armed store clerk because he won’t have given you the opportunity.  This is a very important point; the bad guys, the worst of the worst, will ALWAYS be armed, and so the only question remaining is whether any of the good guys will have the fortitude to arm themselves and stay armed, even if it is inconvenient and potentially makes them more of a target.

One thing that I will not debate because it is simply too obvious to be debatable, is that armed, principled citizens scare the excrement out of the enemy (the enemy being evil in society, and corruption in high places).  It is thus an excellent way of outing the enemy.  It’s like taking the party outside in the sunshine – the vampires will be the ones who protest most loudly, for they CANNOT abide it.  For that reason, and for others, I vigorously promote carrying guns at all times and in all places.
But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.   James 1:25 (KJV)

So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.   James 2:12. (KJV)

Offline G Dog

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #8 on: March 10, 2015, 03:59:56 PM »
DD4 I also respectfully disagree, especially regarding the statement:

"So if I were you, I wouldn't carry open or concealed"

You have my views on OC but Concealed Carry is a different deal all together.  If it's legal and you care to, why wouldn't you carry a weapon?  Not everyone wants to and that's cool but the reasons you give for not packin' a concealed weapon are not very convincing.

Having a firearm in the car seems good, under your seat, not the glove box.  If it's out of sight and you get into a traffic stop the topic of guns will likely never come up.  If asked whether you have a gun, which you probably won't be, just answer the question. 

That suspect/victim in the video did way too much talking, don't you think?  I hate it when citizens play lawyer and at the same time get all obsequious with that sir this and officer that stuff. When dealing with a dumb assed overbearing cop there really isn't much to talk about except just keeping them on topic.  Still ... the guy demeaned himself. Did you sense the cops utter contempt for that idiot?  How not.




« Last Edit: March 10, 2015, 04:11:05 PM by G Dog »
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places".  
                                        Ephesians 6:12  (KJV)

Offline BOOMSTICK BRUCE

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #9 on: March 10, 2015, 06:32:54 PM »
I knew this would happen, i specifically asked for peoples experience open carrying, i.e., experience with police, civilians, business owners, etc. i did not ask for a discussion about peoples' opinions. if you don't like open carry and don't do it, there is no reason to be posting anything on this thread.
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JEEP OWNER!




Offline G Dog

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #10 on: March 10, 2015, 07:01:11 PM »
I knew this would happen  ...  there is no reason to be posting anything on this thread.

What exactly are you talking about anyway?  You clearly are not getting something you want.  What is it that you want then and we will all try to give it to you. 

Your question was pretty poorly stated, but that's OK.  You did not want hearsay, and who would.  You did not want anecdotes, so none of those either.  What the hell is it you after then?

Your last post seems childish.  No, actually it was childish. You should apologize for it. I personally am embarrassed for you.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2015, 07:29:07 PM by G Dog »
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places".  
                                        Ephesians 6:12  (KJV)

Offline BOOMSTICK BRUCE

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2015, 07:15:15 PM »
I knew this would happen  ...  there is no reason to be posting anything on this thread.

What exactly are you talking about anyway?  You clearly are not getting something you want.  What is it you want then and we will all try to give it to you. 

Your last post seems childish.

Really? Did you not read the op?

What are your personal experiences open carrying? Now i dont want this to turn into one of those "well i heard of a friend of my sisters, aunt's, neighbors, best friends, cousin, etc etc got harassed....", what are YOUR personal experiences?

Sorry, I thought the line "What are your personal experiences open carrying?" made it pretty clear what i was asking...

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Offline Kaeto

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #12 on: March 10, 2015, 08:13:12 PM »
I knew this would happen, i specifically asked for peoples experience open carrying, i.e., experience with police, civilians, business owners, etc. i did not ask for a discussion about peoples' opinions. if you don't like open carry and don't do it, there is no reason to be posting anything on this thread.

I gave you exactly what you asked for in my first paragraph.

The city of Grand Rapids (which is the one mentioned in the vid I posted) has a city ordinance banning open carry of guns, but the state has preemption on firearms laws. However  G.R. doesn't want to follow state law. And it's mayor has publicly said so.
“The path of the warrior is difficult! We live to protect those who cannot protect themselves! Honour in serving! Honour in defending! Honour in dying for a just cause!”

"A knight is sworn to valor; His heart knows only virtue; His blade defends the helpless; His might upholds the weak; His word speaks only truth,
and his wrath undoes the wicked."

Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2015, 08:26:20 PM »
DD4 I also respectfully disagree, especially regarding the statement:

"So if I were you, I wouldn't carry open or concealed"    but I did not say never carry.

You have my views on OC but Concealed Carry is a different deal all together.  If it's legal and you care to, why wouldn't you carry a weapon?  Not everyone wants to and that's cool but the reasons you give for not packin' a concealed weapon are not very convincing.   I never said anything about not carrying concealed

Having a firearm in the car seems good, under your seat, not the glove box.  If it's out of sight and you get into a traffic stop the topic of guns will likely never come up.  If asked whether you have a gun, which you probably won't be, just answer the question. 

That suspect/victim in the video did way too much talking, don't you think?  I hate it when citizens play lawyer and at the same time get all obsequious with that sir this and officer that stuff. When dealing with a dumb assed overbearing cop there really isn't much to talk about except just keeping them on topic.  Still ... the guy demeaned himself. Did you sense the cops utter contempt for that idiot?  How not.
I must of missed  referring to

My entire point is, are you prepared to have your life turned totally topsy turvy for carrying, let alone if draw and shoot someone.
Are prepared for going to court, paying an attorney,and perhaps go to prison if the court determines it was a bad shoot?
Only you can answer those questions.
The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps.
General Alexander A. Vandergrift, USMC
to the Senate Naval Affairs Committee, 5 May 1946
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Marines Birthday  11/10/1775
USA birthday  7/4/1776

Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: Open carry
« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2015, 08:28:52 PM »
I knew this would happen, i specifically asked for peoples experience open carrying, i.e., experience with police, civilians, business owners, etc. i did not ask for a discussion about peoples' opinions. if you don't like open carry and don't do it, there is no reason to be posting anything on this thread.
Yes I know you did. I gave a generalized view. But yes I have been questioned by the Police.
While I am legal and it is legal to do so here, they did not like it.
The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps.
General Alexander A. Vandergrift, USMC
to the Senate Naval Affairs Committee, 5 May 1946
------------
Marines Birthday  11/10/1775
USA birthday  7/4/1776