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Author Topic: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"  (Read 22623 times)

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Offline Camo

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #30 on: December 03, 2012, 02:27:27 PM »
Yes I agree Camo,

I don't think many Americans are democrat or republicans anymore, and it certainly isn't a matter of north against south as the media would have us believe. Divide and Conquer seems to be the plan these days.

Since the Constitution was mentioned earlier i think it notable to add that it was the Declaration of Independence that stated "But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

Of course our founders were surely speaking of the King of England here and couldn't have been inferring we should do such a thing  with our own Government. Or were they ?

Just saying :)
Well I believe that they were correct in being to the point and yet ambiguous to satisfy their current situtation and yet address the future as a warning to the people not to be lazy and let gov't get out of your control which is exactly what it is today.
"Let us cross over the river and rest in the shade of the trees"

What did you think, before the evening news told you what to think.

Online Hawg

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #31 on: December 03, 2012, 06:35:17 PM »
Quote from: Majes link=topic=2696.msg81014#msg81014 date=13545couldn't have been inferring we should do such a thing  with our own Government. Or were they ?


[/quote

Sure they were.
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.

Offline Camo

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #32 on: December 08, 2012, 11:07:09 AM »
Well, very excited this morning I got permission to go to Manassas/Bull Run VA. battlefield for a 3 day camping/wargassim vacation in May 2013. I will wait until the new year to make reservations at a campground that also has a shooting range so after touring and getting all fired up I can go to the range and get fired up. I just have to really start saving(no really) to afford the trip. Any one who would be interested to meet up there to tour with and enjoy a camp fire and a cold beverage would be fun too.
"Let us cross over the river and rest in the shade of the trees"

What did you think, before the evening news told you what to think.

Offline Tenhoff

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #33 on: May 09, 2013, 10:04:25 PM »
I was hoping someone might be able to help me out with a quick question. I want to get into civil war reenactments and I was reading through the rules and regs for one; they said for the confederate side head gear "Mixed Gray Forage Cap or any period headgear with little or no Hat-brass" I was wondering if my hat would qualify?

here's what it looks like(never mind my dog M__ ) The  main reason I am wondering is because it has wire in the brim, it's felt if that helps any? Thanks.




"We the people are the rightful masters of both congress and the courts, not to over throw the Constitution but to overthrow the men who would pervert the Constitution" -Abraham Lincoln

Online Hawg

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #34 on: May 10, 2013, 04:27:27 PM »
They might let you squeeze by a time or two but that's not a period hat.
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.

Offline Camo

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #35 on: May 12, 2013, 05:59:39 PM »
tenhoff I agree maybe as a starter hat but most liely you will be offered a spare hat to use from a pard. Remember hats at that time were fashionable as well as personal then as a soldier used as protection from the elements. Early war impressions kepi's would work mid to late war slouch hats. no creased crowns, good luck, when I was researching my impression I looked at tons of photos then headed to the sutler and spend spend spend...
"Let us cross over the river and rest in the shade of the trees"

What did you think, before the evening news told you what to think.


Offline PaleHawkDown

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #37 on: April 09, 2015, 04:57:38 PM »
Yes I agree Camo,

I don't think many Americans are democrat or republicans anymore, and it certainly isn't a matter of north against south as the media would have us believe. Divide and Conquer seems to be the plan these days.

Since the Constitution was mentioned earlier i think it notable to add that it was the Declaration of Independence that stated "But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."

There's a reason the Confederate seal had Washington on it.

Of course our founders were surely speaking of the King of England here and couldn't have been inferring we should do such a thing  with our own Government. Or were they ?

Just saying :)

Offline PaleHawkDown

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #38 on: April 09, 2015, 05:30:12 PM »
tenhoff I agree maybe as a starter hat but most liely you will be offered a spare hat to use from a pard. Remember hats at that time were fashionable as well as personal then as a soldier used as protection from the elements. Early war impressions kepi's would work mid to late war slouch hats. no creased crowns, good luck, when I was researching my impression I looked at tons of photos then headed to the sutler and spend spend spend...

I actually own a European cavalry hat that is newer but was essentially a holdover of 1850s and 1860s era designs that had become traditional and are still used by certain units in parts of the world as dress attire. I have a period photograph of an identical hat being worn by a volunteer U.S. cavalryman. I was told by a reenactment group that it was not acceptable or period. Then I look out and see three Confederate cavalrymen in grey Stetsons, and Union officers using "reissue" style post-war holsters.

We have photos of our ancestors that fought for the Confederacy, and two went off to war in straw hats. I was looking through the regulations of one reenactment group and in bold letters were the words "ABSOLUTELY NO STRAW HATS." The same rule show up in numerous CAS and SAS groups' rules.

I've been involved with all kinds of reenactment groups and the rules are often baffling, and "period" rules are sometimes absurd.

One more anecdote: I was involved in a medieval reenactment group and my persona was late 15th century from the Nuremburg region. I replicated a complete costume based on Albrecht Durer prints and wore it to an event - where I was eviscerated for not being "in period."
The lady's points of contention were A.) I was wearing Birkenstock-style shoes, which show up in no less than seven Duhrer pieces, B.) a large flat brimless cloth hat, as seen in his drawing of Topler Pfinzig, and C.) a loose long tunic with cuffless sleeves - a garment virtually unchanged for centuries. I had my proof that they were correct, which I presented to her, and her response was that she thought I was doing an English persona and she knew none of those things were correct for THAT.



Offline Xring1858

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #39 on: September 30, 2015, 10:33:19 PM »
I was looking around wikipedia tonight and came across this article.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_the_Southern_United_States#Antebellum_era_.281781.E2.80.931860.29

It's long, but a pretty decent read. I found some information that I did not know. Such as, the South didn't have political parties. There is also some numerical statistics, concerning the relative comparisons of the North and South, that I found interesting. As with anything on wiki, until the information  is second source confirmed, you gotta take it with a few grains of HB. But overall, I thought it was compelling.
« Last Edit: September 30, 2015, 10:41:52 PM by Xring1858 »

Offline G Dog

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #40 on: October 01, 2015, 08:09:49 PM »
That's a good article.

The Confederacy never had time for political parties to develop.  Jeff Davis was at a great disadvantage because of that.  Their senators and VP just went evawhichway and were very often at odds with Davis.

The Confederate Constitution is interesting.  A line item veto, a six year presidential one term limit and an express provision prohibiting succession of any state (ironic that).

Hey Xring - got the reference to cum grano salis but what’s HB?
You are at war now; the liberty of your enemies is not an important concern.

Offline Xring1858

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #41 on: October 01, 2015, 10:39:22 PM »
Instead of saying "take it with a few grains of salt", I thought it was funny and more forum appropriate to say take it with a few grains of HB or Holy Black  )L$

I picked up a book at the local library this week titled "War Crines Against Southern Civilians" by Walter Brian Cisco. If your library doesn't have it,  they may be able to inter library loan it from someplace else. It's a very exellent and well written book. I'm only into the second chapter so far. In the first chapter, the author talks about how the Union Army pretty much decimated the population and systematically destroyed much of Missouri.

I love our American history and especially the civil war era. I've been fortunate enough to have visited a few of the battlefields.  I like to read about it during my spare time.
« Last Edit: October 01, 2015, 10:44:22 PM by Xring1858 »

Offline G Dog

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #42 on: October 02, 2015, 12:25:33 AM »
I had been under the impression that the Union Army conducted themselves with some commendable restraint toward the Southern civilian population.  Wrecked a lot of property though, but that’s war time for ya. Compared to other civil wars it seems they did conduct themselves with unheard of circumspection (a rather low bar in certain cases of civil war).  At the end of the war there were no proscription lists which was nearly unheard of up until then.  Henry Wirz got hanged of course but other than that even Jeff Davis and the rest kept their hair. 

Missouri was a killing field - but it cut both ways.  That was the worst place to be as either a civilian or combatant, especially during the early phases of the war.  At least Lane and Jennison were recalled in disgrace, Quantrill was never even reprimanded.

I see that Cisco did a work on Wade Hampton and  one on States Rights Gist (killed at Franklin), those should be interesting too. 

If I weren’t so slow on the uptake I would have recognized the ‘grain of HB’ reference immediately.  A good pun and yep, forum appropriate.  I am pleased that you study the ACW, it’s a noble endeavor and hella interesting - as you said. 


You are at war now; the liberty of your enemies is not an important concern.

Offline M9Powell

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #43 on: October 02, 2015, 05:15:16 PM »
 The South will never forgive or forget Sherman.  {?(  If reconciliation was what Lincoln wanted he should never have sent Sherman. U S Grant was an enemy we can respect, but Sherman never.  {?( Honestly I'm amazed that a Son of the South didn't fetch him after the war. (k-
« Last Edit: October 02, 2015, 05:25:01 PM by M9Powell »

Offline Crawdad

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Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #44 on: August 16, 2016, 08:02:27 PM »
Dear G-Dog,
     I was told this by a member of, "The Confederate HIgh Command," an organisation I was a member of in both Britain and Australia, The man who told me was a vry learned scholar of that period of history, so I just accepted it as the truth!  I
really trusted that man, and he was held in high esteem by others in our group.
     If he was wrong, then I have egg on my face! I have quoted him before, and no one hs ever questioned the truth of the statement!  I don't have a copy of the Constitution, so until someone really looks into it, I must stand corrected.

                                                           JOhnnie Roper, Alias: Gunslinger9378.


It was never written but in order for all the states to ratify the Constitution which was getting increasingly difficult,  it was implied that a state could succeed from the union if that state felt it did not agree with the direction of the Federal government. Look no further than the election of Thomas Jefferson where the New England states wanted to succeed from the Union.


There was two big schools of thought each containing their own legal scholars during the framing and each vehemently disagreeing with one another. One, a state could succeed, the other, a state could not succeed. Those two schools of thought existed until the beginning of the Struggle.


As a side note, the 'Founder' of Western University, now the University of Pittsburgh was previously a congressman who was thrown out of office after he voted to ratify the Constitution, that, "Vile Document."



« Last Edit: August 16, 2016, 08:15:18 PM by Crawdad »