Author Topic: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"  (Read 36414 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline G Dog

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 3588
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #60 on: August 25, 2016, 01:39:16 PM »
Just saying that Lt. General Jackson gets a little too much credit for what General Lee ordered him to do.

I agree and have never quite understood the cult of adulation surrounding Stonewall.  But then, I’m not a Sutheron and may be congenitally unable to make the necessary connections.  He and Lee made quite a team though, while the party lasted.  The ‘Stonewall Cavalry’ notwithstanding, sometimes he would get into a snit and move real slow.  From most accounts he sounds like a hard man to work for.
You are at war now; the liberty of your enemies is not an important concern.

Offline BlackpowderJim

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 179
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #61 on: August 25, 2016, 01:52:50 PM »
I remember as a young kid, the last of the Civil War vets dying. I was 11 years old at the beginning of the CW Centennial. There was a large display of artifacts and original weapons for sale at a convention at the old Stardust Hotel. Wish I had the money to buy something significant, but I did get a cool confederate belt plate for about $12.00.

Offline G Dog

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 3588
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #62 on: August 25, 2016, 02:41:09 PM »
Hey, BP J, I remember that.  Heard it on the radio or TV news and as a little kid it really struck me.  The next day at school the teacher mentioned it.  She was from Tennessee and so was conscious of The War.  She had the nicest accent.  Smooth round vowels and easy to hear consonants, didn’t rush her words.  I liked that then, still do.  I came up on the beach in S. CA and so I talk ‘surfer dude’, totally brah.

Good quote for anybody:  “Remember, where I come from you’re the one with the accent.”
You are at war now; the liberty of your enemies is not an important concern.

Offline Crawdad

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 42
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #63 on: August 25, 2016, 03:36:42 PM »
Just saying that Lt. General Jackson gets a little too much credit for what General Lee ordered him to do.

I agree and have never quite understood the cult of adulation surrounding Stonewall.  But then, I’m not a Sutheron and may be congenitally unable to make the necessary connections.  He and Lee made quite a team though, while the party lasted.  The ‘Stonewall Cavalry’ notwithstanding, sometimes he would get into a snit and move real slow.  From most accounts he sounds like a hard man to work for.


Great points, "sometimes he would get into a snit and move real slow" and great quote. I'm dealing with an expert here so I better make sure I double check and triple check my sources before posting.  (T^

Offline Crawdad

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 42
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #64 on: August 25, 2016, 03:46:44 PM »
Look no further than the Peninsula Campaign, where A.P. Hill defied orders and attacked as he grew anxious when waiting for Jackson to come down from the Valley.

Offline G Dog

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 3588
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #65 on: August 25, 2016, 04:19:50 PM »
I'm dealing with an expert here   (T^

Pshaw (both of my grandmothers used that term).  Thanks for the compliment though, but I’m just a student of the thing.

Hey, best definition of the Civil War I’ve come across.  It’s from William Faulkner’s Absalom, Absalom, (Modern Library Edition).  He was from Oxford, MS and his grandfather was an officer in Forest’s command so I guess he knew something about this.

“… a horrible and bloody mischancing of human affairs.” P.101

And later:  “A stupid and bloody aberration in the high (and impossible) destiny of the United States.” P.118


You are at war now; the liberty of your enemies is not an important concern.

Offline Crawdad

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 42
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #66 on: August 25, 2016, 08:43:18 PM »
Our Struggle was just a prelude to the coming massacre of World War One where the generals finally recognized the offensive limitations of infantry without support.  But another point in history that directly involves Gettysburg and the absence of Stuart's cavalry. An unsung hero of the wide flanking attack that crushed O.O. Howard's 11th Corp was the reconnoitering by Fitzhugh Lee's brigade of cavalry that steered General Jackson right to the far right flank and rear of the 11th corp. So much so that it is reported that the Confederate cavalry could see the supply trains of the 11th Corp. That's how deep they were.

If only General Ewell knew what was on his left flank on the first day of Gettysburg. Or if Stuart would have been with Ewell on the attack on Cemetery Hill.  No wonder General Lee kept asking everyone he met along the way through Pennsylvania, "Have you seen Stuart?"

Offline Gunslinger9378

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 2388
  • Some will...some won't....But I do!
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #67 on: February 24, 2017, 03:20:20 PM »
Dear Friends,
         As a Firm admirer of Thomas Jonathan (Stonewall.) Jackson, I have to say that this death after Chancellorsville, was a major tragedy for, "The Southern Confederacy!"  Had Lee had him at Gettysburg, the end of that battle may well have been a resounding Victory for the Confederacy!  On the First day, Had Lee had Jackson and his famous, "Foot Cavalry,"  Little Round Top would have fallen into Confederate hands!  Jackson would not have floundered around like that Bald-Headed old Fool, Ewell !  He would have gone to the right, and would have caught Hancock with his pants around his ankles!  Then the road WOULD have been open all the way to Washington!  This point was made in the Movie, "Gettysburg, when the other Confederate General, (Whose name momentarily escapes me.) complained to General Lee, about Ewell's inaction over Little Round Top, which earlier that day had been completely free of Federal troops, and had been literally there, "For the taking!"
Had Jacksons Troops been firmly ensconced on Little Round Top, not even TWO Lawrence Chamberlain's, and double the strength of the 20th. Maine, could have dislodged them!
         I have the movie, "Gods & Generals," which focuses strongly on General Jackson.  From reading about him, I'd have to agree he was a lousy Instructor at his Academy, in but as a tactician on the Battlefield, he had few equals!
        Military Intelligence has been an Oxymoron, for me, (Don't believe I have spelled that properly?) since on the afternoon of my beloved Father's Funeral, I returned home, and sitting in his beloved old Leather Armchair, I reached for and began reading the World War One History of his Regiment, the Queen's Westminster Rifles, a part of the 56th. London Division.  I looked up the, "Battle of the Somme," which began on July the 1st. 1916. Dad's older brother, Harry, was killed on that day, and my Dad wounded so grievously, the surgeons had to remove his left leg right from the Hip Joint. He had laid out in N0-Man's Land for 36 hours. No medics or stretcher bearer's ever put in an appearance, and Dad could smell the Gangrene in his
own leg. 
       As I read the history of that frightful say, I found a passage that made me burn with rage and indignation!  As best as I can recall, it said.  "At 08.00 hundred hours, The Queen's Westminster Rifles, marched across No-Man's Land as if on parade!"
Fifty years earlier, almost to the day, Lee had used this self same tactic at Gettysburg!  Had the Military learned nothing in fifty-three years?????  Picket was facing 2000 riflemen armed with single shot .58 caliber rifles.  Dad and his comrades faced German  Bolt Action Rifle's, that had six rounds rapid available if the soldiers started with one, "Up the Spout!"  The stupid
Bastards had learned NOTHING in fifty three years!  I wept for my poor Father, and for the man who would have become my Uncle Harry.
         As a young boy, my heroes were the Fighter Pilots who took on the Luftwaffe, in Spitfires and Hurricanes, and later, the men of the United States Army Air Force, who risked Frostbite, and a horrible death in burning Bombers over the Third Reich!
But my number One Hero was AlWAYS  my Dad!  He still is!  I am now 22 years older that he was when he died.  So it cannot possibly be too many years, before I will be able to meet him, and tell him for the first time, just how much I loved him.
        Many of you will have loved one who have, "Gone on ahead of you to Eternity!"  For those of them who you still have.  Tell them of your admiration for the things they did to preserve The Free World.  Then you won't have to wait over 62 years to tell them, "Up Yonder!"   Like me!       
                                                  May God Bless you All!             Gunslinger9378.
Never make the mistake of thinking I will not shoot..........
Because it may be your very last mistake!

Offline Len

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 2744
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #68 on: February 24, 2017, 03:42:57 PM »
Thanks Johnnie,
it's good to have you back on here. We did miss you and your opinions/views, during your absence (probably riding the Outlaw Trail south from WY to AZ on a horse named Hank.

Offline Hawg

  • Administrator
  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 8813
  • You done went and done it now!
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #69 on: February 24, 2017, 06:17:20 PM »
Welcome back Johnnie. ])M
Meddle not in the affairs of dragons, for thou art crunchy, and taste good with ketchup.

Offline G Dog

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 3588
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #70 on: February 24, 2017, 08:56:59 PM »
Hello Johnnie.

Ewell failed to take Culp’s Hill on the north end.  Little Round Top (south end, Union left) was never in Ewell’s II Corp sector.  That was attacked by Hood under Longstreet.   George Meade was the Union commander, not Hancock. 

Buffs tend to overrate Jackson.

Welcome back.   
You are at war now; the liberty of your enemies is not an important concern.

Offline BOOMSTICK BRUCE

  • I said I never had much use for a rifle, never said I couldn't use it...
  • Administrator
  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *****
  • Posts: 2020
  • SASS #105711
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #71 on: February 24, 2017, 09:51:53 PM »
johnnys back!!!! (k-
l
l _______
 /l ,[____],
l---L -OlllllllO-
()_) ()_)-o--)_)
JEEP OWNER!




Offline Gunslinger9378

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 2388
  • Some will...some won't....But I do!
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #72 on: February 25, 2017, 12:04:56 PM »
Dear Friends,
            My Heartfelt thanks for the notes of those who have welcomed me back into the Fold!  It is great to be able to hear form you all.  Yes, G Dog, I knew that Meade was the overall commander, but it was Hancocks men, or his corps, that took the brunt of the attack on the Union Center at the Stone Wall.  The "Highwater Mark," of the Confederacy where poor Lo Armish died. 
            I guess I will always be an, "Un-Reconstructed Gray-back!"  I've always, in typical British Fashion, supported the Underdog in conflicts!  Just part of my early up-bringing I guess!

                                           Thanks again Yawl!                         Johnnie!
Never make the mistake of thinking I will not shoot..........
Because it may be your very last mistake!

Online DD4lifeusmc

  • Ultimate Forum Legend
  • *******
  • Posts: 8595
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #73 on: May 15, 2017, 11:43:07 AM »
did you know

One-third of the soldiers who fought for the Union Army were immigrants, and nearly one in 10 was African American.
The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps.
General Alexander A. Vandergrift, USMC
to the Senate Naval Affairs Committee, 5 May 1946
------------
Marines Birthday  11/10/1775
USA birthday  7/4/1776

Offline PaleHawkDown

  • Forum Legend
  • ******
  • Posts: 1145
Re: The War Between the States-The "Civil War"
« Reply #74 on: May 15, 2017, 04:24:15 PM »
did you know

One-third of the soldiers who fought for the Union Army were immigrants, and nearly one in 10 was African American.

In our family five brothers immigrated from Prussia and Hesse in the 1850s and 1860s. When the fifth brother arrived in America in 1863, family legend tells that he was asked what his career in "Germany" had been.
"I was the fifth son," he supposedly replied.
Since that meant nothing to the Irishman asking him questions he supposedly clarified, "As a fifth son in Prussia I must be either a soldier or a priest. I was a soldier."
"What was your rank?"
He explained that he was an officer and was essentially told, "Congratulations, you are now a Lieutenant with the U.S. Infantry. You have two weeks to show up for duty."

He was placed in a "German" unit, but a letter he wrote home explained that the Union's idea of "German" included many people who were not even remotely "Germanic", and were a mix of a dozen different languages and cultures from Scandinavia to Poland, from the Volga to Northern Italy. Communication issues were rampant, and worse, the American officers in charge not only spoke NONE of the languages in question, but had considerably less training and experience than many of the enlisted men or any of their European-born junior officers.

My uncle took a bullet to the leg at Chickamauga and died of infection two weeks later at the field hospital near Chattanooga.

Not long after the fourth brother decided he had had his fill of America and went back to Hesse, Darmstadt. He had left Germany to avoid all the political intrigue and constant fighting, only to lose a brother to the fighting here.

He kept the Americanized spelling of the family name, however, and every German with that version of our family name comes from him. 90% of that branch of the family stayed in Darmstadt, with only a few moving to neighboring areas.

These ancestors were largely wiped out during the firebombing of Darmstadt by U.S. forces during WWII.

As a result, our family line, which can be traced back to the 15th century in Germany in an unbroken line, now has more members in America than in the country they came from.