1858 remington forum

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Offline Mad Dog Stafford

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #15 on: February 28, 2015, 03:32:31 PM »
Boy! Looks like someone took a bite out of the brim of his hat!  (?^
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Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #16 on: February 28, 2015, 06:47:12 PM »
Being this forum is primarily about the Black Powder powered  1858 remington revolver,
I really don't see a need to discuss use of smokeless modern powders to start with.
To me it's pushing the envelope just talking about conversion cylinders.
even though many originals were converted as a stop gap measure between the BP of the 19th century
and the designed to use cartridge guns in the early 1870's.

So we really shouldn't be talking about using a smokeless powder anyway.
The moderators should continue to edit anything they feel could be unsafe.
Post the editing in the forum and send a pm  to the poster.
I'm sure there are plenty of forums that deal with smokeless powder and what is and what is not safe
« Last Edit: March 01, 2015, 08:53:40 AM by DD4lifeusmc »
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Offline Captainkirk

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #17 on: February 28, 2015, 09:26:09 PM »
I'm sure there are plenty of forums that deal with smokeless powder and what id and what is safe
As a matter of fact.....
one of the reloading forums I used to frequent would not allow any load data to be posted unless it was confirmed that the load was previously published data from a major reloading data source, and also did not exceed SAAMI specs.
No home-brewed load data allowed.
It pissed off a few people, but that didn't concern the admins there. They were more concerned with liability lawsuits than losing a few hard-heads. Can't say I disagree.
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Offline Mad Dog Stafford

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #18 on: March 01, 2015, 07:38:39 AM »
But wait, we do have a Modern Guns thread to post on here. Don't Modern guns use smokeless powder?
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Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #19 on: March 01, 2015, 09:05:46 AM »
But wait, we do have a Modern Guns thread to post on here. Don't Modern guns use smokeless powder?

Without going through all the child boards,  I'd say not really MD.  Yes we do allow talk of them here, because we are a more open and relaxed bunch here, that tolerate other modern smokeless guns.
But in reality based on what the forum is really about, it should just be Black Powder and Substitutes.
As I said before. To me conversion cylinders are pushing the envelope into modern cartridge guns. But they too are mostly
BP powders. although some do use smokeless.
BP and subs is relatively safe in loading. Not much chance of blowing the revolver up and maiming or killing yourself or a bystander, because you loaded 2 grains too much.  Yea it could happen but not likely.
In a singleshot pistol or rifle (both muzzle loaders)  different story. Yep you could have an oops there if too much powder was used. But it would be more in the  25 grains or more too much.  Unless you were already at the manufacturers recommended maximum load. Then even 5 gr, could cause an oops!
Not so with smokeless.  2 gr of some smokeless powder can make a huge difference.
Therefore I fully agree with the MODS,  what is and / or what isn't a safe substitute load of smokeless powders for guns designed to use Black Powder or a known commercial substitute, should be curtailed.
And in BP  everybody should continue to refer to their owners manual for recommended max loads of BP.
The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps.
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to the Senate Naval Affairs Committee, 5 May 1946
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Marines Birthday  11/10/1775
USA birthday  7/4/1776

Offline Dellbert

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #20 on: March 01, 2015, 09:33:33 AM »
But wait, we do have a Modern Guns thread to post on here. Don't Modern guns use smokeless powder?

Nobody has abused it in any way. People can post the wrong info on there and get pulled off just the same. You can blow up modern guns just as fast as black powder guns.
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Offline Hawg

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #21 on: March 01, 2015, 09:41:05 AM »
everybody should continue to refer to their owners manual for recommended max loads of BP.

I wouldn't go that far especially where revolvers are concerned. The owners manual(pamphlet) is so lawyered up its ludicrous. Plus you have to take into account the brass frames which cant handle as much without damage to the gun.
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Offline Mad Dog Stafford

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #22 on: March 01, 2015, 10:10:59 AM »
I saw the black powder guns that Fingerhut is selling. On the 1858 Remington Brass Frame they stated to use 30gr of black powder...I wouldn't use that much myself. In a steel frame I might but, not a brass frame.
Also, I saw the same on the 1851 brass frame Colt. 30gr of black powder is not good.
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Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #23 on: March 01, 2015, 10:15:33 AM »
But wait, we do have a Modern Guns thread to post on here. Don't Modern guns use smokeless powder?

Nobody has abused it in any way. People can post the wrong info on there and get pulled off just the same. You can blow up modern guns just as fast as black powder guns.

Actually easier.  There are so many modern smokeless powders out there that have different pressures and burn rates.

Whereas in Black powder not so much. Unless you started playing around with the idea, what is a safe smokeless load in a Blackpowder gun.
There is no real safe smokeless  for a black powder gun..... deliberately exempting conversion cylinders.
The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps.
General Alexander A. Vandergrift, USMC
to the Senate Naval Affairs Committee, 5 May 1946
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Marines Birthday  11/10/1775
USA birthday  7/4/1776

Offline Classanr

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #24 on: March 01, 2015, 10:16:36 AM »
Fingerhut is selling guns?  {:(
"The times they are a-changin'"

Fingerhut is not well-known for copious and accurate instructions.
I have always considered Fingerhut as "the ultimate source for over-priced desctructables."

So, I suppose that makes a good example of caution in posting on Forums.
Jim Beam me, Scotty!  Life here is more intelligent than I.

Offline DD4lifeusmc

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #25 on: March 01, 2015, 11:28:19 AM »
everybody should continue to refer to their owners manual for recommended max loads of BP.

I wouldn't go that far especially where revolvers are concerned. The owners manual(pamphlet) is so lawyered up its ludicrous. Plus you have to take into account the brass frames which cant handle as much without damage to the gun.

Once again a reply didn't stay.
Yes we know since the 1970's manufacturers have lawyered up and have reduced the maximum loads they recommend.
even though most of us just continue to load that same as we always have.
But still for liability sakes, especially for newbies, go to the owners manual and use the recommendations there.
If you decide to push the envelop, you're on your own.
Even if some body on a forum says it is ok to load  xxx gr or claim they do it all the time. No matter how you write it, a lawyer will spin doctor it into being your fault, not the guy that did it. especially if it is about using smokeless in a BP gun.
that's todays  new society. Blame the other guy and sue him.
In our case it would be even worse, to let posting continuously appear, about "safe" loads  of modern smokeless in a revolver specifically designed for and labeled for BLACK POWDER ONLY.
So to all shooter and especially newbies  stay with what the maker recommends.
You want to push the envelope. that's on you.  And yes we all do it, we push it.
I have my favorite load in all my revolvers. And no it is not what what the manufacturer recommends.
If you want to discuss it take it to a PM where only you see it, or take it to email.
Me?  I tend to be more of a purist.  BP or a substitute specifically made for BP and no cartridge conversion cylinders.
I want to shoot cartridge I get out the revolver that was designed for it.


The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps.
General Alexander A. Vandergrift, USMC
to the Senate Naval Affairs Committee, 5 May 1946
------------
Marines Birthday  11/10/1775
USA birthday  7/4/1776

Offline G Dog

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #26 on: March 01, 2015, 12:21:08 PM »
DD4lifeusmc puts it well:

(If/When)  ...  "I want to shoot cartridge I get out the revolver that was designed for it."

A very sensible and straight forward proposition.  Damn right.
« Last Edit: March 01, 2015, 12:31:28 PM by G Dog »
"For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places".   
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Offline ssb73q

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #27 on: March 01, 2015, 12:32:06 PM »
Hi, have you never heard of natural selection?  )L$ (?^ ->i

I prefer Darwin over the nanny state.  :9)

Regards,
Old Richard
 
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Offline Captainkirk

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #28 on: March 01, 2015, 09:07:26 PM »
Hi, have you never heard of natural selection?  )L$ (?^ ->i

I prefer Darwin over the nanny state.  :9)

Regards,
Old Richard

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Offline PaleHawkDown

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Re: How NOT to post on this Forum
« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2015, 01:31:11 PM »
While I have a general dislike for any post being pulled, I do see why Classnr did it, and I'm glad he did - not for any of our regulars here, but for the people who just stumble by, and who might not know better.

People call me regularly to ask about loading data, or they ask questions I do not know the answer to about something obscure, or they are new and we are playing a game of telephone trying to decipher what the other person is telling us, or they just want a place where they can read up on what others have done so they can learn more.

Legally I have to tell them to only use the data in their manuals, I know Italian maker marks and can help them identify things - but I can't really give them a lot of advice on products we do not carry, some people can only understand things visually, and knowledge needs a place to be processed in a person's own time.

I generally send those people to this fine forum. You guys are a great source of info, the page is well policed for inaccuracies, this is probably the friendliest BP site on the net, and it is easily the most accessible for novices and pros alike.

I've been on BP sites where one person posts a dangerous information, and no one says a word. This isn't one.